After Manny Ramirez passed the great Mickey Mantle for sole possession of 15th place in career home runs, the venerable Twins great and Hall of Famer Harmon Killebrew told the MINNEAPOLIS STAR-TRIBUNE that “to see his name above Mantle’s on the list . . . that’s a shame.”
(A hero, yes, but an authority on PEDs?)
Killebrew was a contemporary of Mantle’s; each terrorized the AL en route to well over 500 home runs and both are members of the Hall of Fame, but there the similarities end. While Mantle’s well-known as a prolific party animal, Killebrew eschewed the lifestyle, telling SPORTS ILLUSTRATED back in 1963 that for fun, he “like[s] to wash dishes.”
So it’s that disconnect from Mantle’s world that provides the only possible justification for the ignorance displayed by Killebrew with that statement.
The fact of the matter is that performance-enhancing substance abuse is nothing new for major league baseball. Until steroids struck in the early 1990s, as a matter of fact, Killebrew and Mantle played in the heyday of PEDs in baseball.
No, hormonal adjustments weren’t exactly being performed like today, and it’s pretty evident that there are greater effects by taking HGH than by taking anything used in the ’60s.
But back then, usage of amphetamines, or “greenies,” was so widespread that playing while not under their influence was referred to as “playing naked.” Lord only knows what was running through Mantle’s veins in the outfield, but it was more than just plain old American red blood.
Moreover, Mantle was more than a bit of a lout, though (usually) humorously so. When asked to provide his favorite Yankee Stadium memory by his old club, for example, and his answer was completely and totally unrepeatable (pops to .pdf with ludicrously NSFW language) (via ROTOWORLD).
Meanwhile, Manny used steroids. He was caught, he served his suspension, and now he’s back and still raking. So let’s keep this straight: the difference between Manny and Mantle isn’t PED use, it’s the scope to which they were effective. If Mantle had access to steroids, does Killebrew actually think Mantle would have said “no”? The real Mickey Mantle, we mean, not the lionized baseball card hero that never really existed outside the imaginations of children.
If Killebrew really thinks that, well, that’s probably a very foolish proposition.
4:15 pm on July 23rd, 2009
You seriously wrote this. Your calling Harmon Killebrew ignorant for the statement “to see his name above Mantle’s on the list . . . that’s a shame.”.
You my friend are a f***ing moron. 95 percent of the country would probably agree with Harmon.
4:15 pm on July 23rd, 2009
You must be young to defend Manny..Killebrew is correct, these cheaters should not be cheered..
4:32 pm on July 23rd, 2009
Are you kidding me? You call Killebrew foolish because he rips a known cheater. Then you compare Greenies to HGH and Steroids. Wow! If I were to use the word “foolish” in referencing this post….I think I’d use it to describe the poster.
4:45 pm on July 23rd, 2009
Brooks,
This is the worst post I’ve ever read on your site. Adam J needs to go!
4:48 pm on July 23rd, 2009
This is not even a very good rationalization of Manny Ramirez and other PED users.
And to imply Mantle used amphetamines like you did here was wrong (and you did….re-read what you wrote). No proof on Mantle, whereas Manny is a proven cheater. It’s documented.
If anything, substances that Mantle used/abused cut short his career and curtailed his performance on the field.
4:53 pm on July 23rd, 2009
Who cares?
Only baseball players care about list and stats,
And we all know old baseball players are the most notorious chapped ass haters in the world,
The mind set of an old time baseball player is….Nobody after the generation in which I played should ever get credit for doing anything.
hey harmon, go away now.
5:07 pm on July 23rd, 2009
They should only get credit when they have earned and deserve it. And not gone out of their way to circumvent the rules. It’s a thing you clearly don’t understand: it’s called respect.
5:22 pm on July 23rd, 2009
Who really cares anymore about pro baseball, b-ball, and especially football except losers with no real life or media guys like Brooks make a living following these creeps?
5:23 pm on July 23rd, 2009
Who really cares anymore about pro baseball, b-ball, and especially football except losers with no real life or media guys like Brooks who make a living following these creeps?
5:59 pm on July 23rd, 2009
Im sure back in Mickey Mantles day they cheated too.
( watch Ken Burns Baseball documentary , it told you how they cheated)
It was just the four newspaper writers that covered Mickey at that time were wined and dined and had 100% access to the players,
you would be stupid to to lose your job, your jobs access, your trust with the players free food ( that the writer couldn’t afford to buy for themselves) just to tell the truth about what the player was doing in the clubhouse and after the game and what he did to cheat.
every generation of baseball had cheaters
from HGH steroids to pine tar to cork bats to crooked umps to gambling by players, managers and owners, to not letting some minorities play that weremore skilled in the league based on race to sharpening spikes to the black sox to the cutting base’s scandal to foreign substances on the ball, to bats fiiled with superballs to urethane core bats to signal stealing to faking catches to ringers wearing duplicate jerseys.
Yeah Mannys the only one who cheated
this sports is built on cheaters
enjoy it for what it is entertainment
6:54 pm on July 23rd, 2009
Sour grapes Harmon! The level of play in this era far far exceeds what happened in the days of Mantle etc.
The Mick probably never even heard of a wicked lefty throwing splittys at him in the late innings…they had no technical closers….starters grunted their sorry arms deep into most games…the game has passed by those old timers.
So Manny took PED….who cares! Probably more than less, also have! All I care about are the great plays and I could give a rip as to what enhancement these moron players pump into their bodys! If a guy wants to make it big for a handful of years at the risk of his pecker falling off, so be it…Just play ball! (and let the market decide how much you get paid) until you cannot make the team anymore..Quit crying Killebrew and all the rest of those old sanctimonious oldtimers!
1:58 pm on July 24th, 2009
I think he took exception to the washing dishes remark….nobody like to wash dishes……the ignorance.